Is the war on gun owners using pot about to end?

[tector]

Maybe. There is a serious effort afoot to reschedule marijuana from Schedule I (you know, like heroin) to Schedule III. This would be particularly good news for vets who use pot for PTSD and physical pain, but would also like their 2nd Amendment rights (you know, one of the things they supposedly fought for).

About 50 years overdue, but hey, it's really a great country.

https://www.sun-sentinel.com/2024/04/30 ... substance/

[GunsandHoses]

Was wondering the same when I heard this today! Another attempted vote getter for the WH tard! It ain't about helpin' gun owners!

[tector]

Was wondering the same when I heard this today! Another attempted vote getter for the WH tard! It ain't about helpin' gun owners!

Oh, that's for sure. But Biden has proven he'll do anything to buy votes, even if it has unintended consequences.

[FfNJGTFO]

I don't think LE will ever permit it. As many LEOs and Feds that were killed in all the "pot wars" in Calif. etc. (i.e. raiding pot farms, etc.)....
Not gonna happen.

[tector]

I don't think LE will ever permit it. As many LEOs and Feds that were killed in all the "pot wars" in Calif. etc. (i.e. raiding pot farms, etc.)....
Not gonna happen.

Did you read the article? Do you understand what is being proposed? Do you understand that during Prohibition, all kinds of government agents were killed trying to enforce it? Are you aware of what has already happened in many states (which is distinct, and further reaching, than this proposal), which means you are already obviously wrong in many places already? Did you...

Nevermind.

[FfNJGTFO]

I don't think LE will ever permit it. As many LEOs and Feds that were killed in all the "pot wars" in Calif. etc. (i.e. raiding pot farms, etc.)....
Not gonna happen.

Did you read the article? Do you understand what is being proposed? Do you understand that during Prohibition, all kinds of government agents were killed trying to enforce it?

Yes, Yes, & Yes. And, as far as prohibition is concerned, that was then... this is now. The Feds tend to take the murder of their fellow agents a lot more seriously these days than before. Furthermore, the demand for alcohol was tolerated a lot more than Pot ever has been or will be. Hence, the eventual end of prohibition.

Are you aware of what has already happened in many states (which is distinct, and further reaching, than this proposal)....

Again, yes. But again, these are the individual States. We're talking about the Feds here. The states (those that have legalized it) can see the "revenue potential" in it. The feds don't recognize it at all. Pot bad. And nothing the states can do will stop the Feds from coming in and enforcing their laws on people. Did you fill out a 4473 recently?

Did you?

Nevermind, indeed!

[tector]

Well, there is no question that the impetus to do this is NOT a desire to lower hurdles on gun purchases. The Biden Administration would never do that. It is likely motivated by a desire to clear up questions for banks and others that do business with pot/THC businesses. So, no, rescheduling would NOT automatically change anything regarding 4473.

But it IS significant in that the ATF (if it refused to change 4473) would now face a tsunami of litigation, both civil suits and criminal defense, where it would have to justify retaining a restriction on a constitutional right (2A) on a substance that the feds themselves have plainly devalued in terms of 'harm". 18 USC 922 --enacted long before modern 2A jurisprudence (which started with Heller 16 years ago)--makes no distinction covering all 5 schedules. As a practical matter, however, only Schedule 1 cases (to my knowledge) have hit the courts since Heller, and even there the ATF has a mixed record at best (https://norml.org/blog/2023/08/10/appea ... consumers/). Now they would be face cases everywhere where the Schedule 1 rationales (only partly successful themselves) are gone. It will be a MUCH better environment for the weed cases.

You might have some weird alliances on these cases in court. "Conservative" judges with a strong 2A orientation would be on our side, of course, but you MIGHT also get some lib judges (especially in the criminal cases) concerned about the "disparate impact" that such an arbitrary rule has on "minority" communities. If they can keep some brothers out of jail (their life's work, it seems), they might ride along.

[Miami_JBT]

Marijuana is currently classified as a Schedule I substance, which means it is considered to have no medical value and a high potential for abuse.

It does not automatically make it something that can be prescribed ad a traditional pharmaceutical product when it is rescheduled. Nor does it change its legal classification ad a controlled substance which leads to felony arrest under federal law.

The Biden Administration through the FDA has recommended that it be moved to Schedule III, reflecting a determination that cannabis has a moderate to low potential for abuse, an accepted medical use, and a moderate or low potential for physical dependence or a high potential for psychological dependence. If reclassified, marijuana would be considered a drug with safe and accepted medical uses, and it would ease restrictions on medical research and legitimize the marijuana industry on a national level.

It would still be illegal under federal law and possession would still be a crime, and using it would still bar people from completing a 4473.

[tector]

If people want a brief overview of scheduling, they can go here, the Almighty DEA itself:

https://www.dea.gov/drug-information/drug-scheduling

Schedule I

Schedule I drugs, substances, or chemicals are defined as drugs with no currently accepted medical use and a high potential for abuse. Some examples of Schedule I drugs are: heroin, lysergic acid diethylamide (LSD), marijuana (cannabis), 3,4-methylenedioxymethamphetamine (ecstasy), methaqualone, and peyote.

Schedule II

Schedule II drugs, substances, or chemicals are defined as drugs with a high potential for abuse, with use potentially leading to severe psychological or physical dependence. These drugs are also considered dangerous. Some examples of Schedule II drugs are: combination products with less than 15 milligrams of hydrocodone per dosage unit (Vicodin), cocaine, methamphetamine, methadone, hydromorphone (Dilaudid), meperidine (Demerol), oxycodone (OxyContin), fentanyl, Dexedrine, Adderall, and Ritalin

Schedule III

Schedule III drugs, substances, or chemicals are defined as drugs with a moderate to low potential for physical and psychological dependence. Schedule III drugs abuse potential is less than Schedule I and Schedule II drugs but more than Schedule IV. Some examples of Schedule III drugs are: products containing less than 90 milligrams of codeine per dosage unit (Tylenol with codeine), ketamine, anabolic steroids, testosterone

Schedule IV

Schedule IV drugs, substances, or chemicals are defined as drugs with a low potential for abuse and low risk of dependence. Some examples of Schedule IV drugs are: Xanax, Soma, Darvon, Darvocet, Valium, Ativan, Talwin, Ambien, Tramadol

Schedule V

Schedule V drugs, substances, or chemicals are defined as drugs with lower potential for abuse than Schedule IV and consist of preparations containing limited quantities of certain narcotics. Schedule V drugs are generally used for antidiarrheal, antitussive, and analgesic purposes. Some examples of Schedule V drugs are: cough preparations with less than 200 milligrams of codeine or per 100 milliliters (Robitussin AC), Lomotil, Motofen, Lyrica, Parepectolin

So weed would go from keeping company with heroin and LSD to being tagged up with steroids and testosterone.

Anybody on testosterone therapy had an issue purchasing a gun recently?

Again, I don't deny the ATF could try to keep the current practice re weed in place--I just think they will get their asses kicked in court once the Schedule 1 foundation is eliminated.

[Miami_JBT]

If people want a brief overview of scheduling, they can go here, the Almighty DEA itself:

https://www.dea.gov/drug-information/drug-scheduling

Schedule I

Schedule I drugs, substances, or chemicals are defined as drugs with no currently accepted medical use and a high potential for abuse. Some examples of Schedule I drugs are: heroin, lysergic acid diethylamide (LSD), marijuana (cannabis), 3,4-methylenedioxymethamphetamine (ecstasy), methaqualone, and peyote.

Schedule II

Schedule II drugs, substances, or chemicals are defined as drugs with a high potential for abuse, with use potentially leading to severe psychological or physical dependence. These drugs are also considered dangerous. Some examples of Schedule II drugs are: combination products with less than 15 milligrams of hydrocodone per dosage unit (Vicodin), cocaine, methamphetamine, methadone, hydromorphone (Dilaudid), meperidine (Demerol), oxycodone (OxyContin), fentanyl, Dexedrine, Adderall, and Ritalin

Schedule III

Schedule III drugs, substances, or chemicals are defined as drugs with a moderate to low potential for physical and psychological dependence. Schedule III drugs abuse potential is less than Schedule I and Schedule II drugs but more than Schedule IV. Some examples of Schedule III drugs are: products containing less than 90 milligrams of codeine per dosage unit (Tylenol with codeine), ketamine, anabolic steroids, testosterone

Schedule IV

Schedule IV drugs, substances, or chemicals are defined as drugs with a low potential for abuse and low risk of dependence. Some examples of Schedule IV drugs are: Xanax, Soma, Darvon, Darvocet, Valium, Ativan, Talwin, Ambien, Tramadol

Schedule V

Schedule V drugs, substances, or chemicals are defined as drugs with lower potential for abuse than Schedule IV and consist of preparations containing limited quantities of certain narcotics. Schedule V drugs are generally used for antidiarrheal, antitussive, and analgesic purposes. Some examples of Schedule V drugs are: cough preparations with less than 200 milligrams of codeine or per 100 milliliters (Robitussin AC), Lomotil, Motofen, Lyrica, Parepectolin

So weed would go from keeping company with heroin and LSD to being tagged up with steroids and testosterone.

Anybody on testosterone therapy had an issue purchasing a gun recently?

Again, I don't deny the ATF could try to keep the current practice re weed in place--I just think they will get their asses kicked in court once the Schedule 1 foundation is eliminated.

Scheduling alone does not legalize it. There are specific statues in US Code that make it a controlled substance going back to the 1930s.