Florida Shooters Network

So, I am finally thinking about adding something with a bit more pop' to the collection. So far, I have stuck to shotguns, handguns, and a 30-30 for hunting,

I have no real use for one, other than I want one....but I would maybe use it as a secondary hunting rifle...and as a SHTF gun.

At first I thought about building an AR, but I am now leaning towards an ak variant instead, and was thinking about getting a saiga and possibly converting it.

First question.....Is that the smart route to go? Or would it be better just to pick up an actual AK? Cost? Resale value? Fun to shoot? Reliability and Quality? Would be key factors in that decision.

Secondly....I am not even sure what caliber I would want? 5.56, 7.62x51, or even something like 7.62×39 or 5.45x39. Cost and availability of ammo would be key here, so I guess the 5.56 would have an edge(am I right in that assumption?) or would it be better to move up to 7.62x51 to have more secondary uses such as hunting?

Lets say, that you wanted to keep the total cost of the gun(not including ammo) less than $800.

Any help or advice for someone new to this area of firearms would be greatly appreciated. Thanks in advance....

Converted Saiga is a good choice. 5.45 would be the cheapest to plink with.

I enjoy the 5.45 round. Had a Vepr II in 5.45 and it was amazingly accurate, had surprisingly low recoil, and the round has good ballistics. Ammo, however, is usually corrosive and requires extra cleaning or spending more for non-corrosive ammo.

7.62x39 is the round of choice in an ak47 for me.

IMO, if you want 556, build an AR. To me an AK should have the 'pop' of the 7.62x39 round. Again, it's all my opinions.

I just bought an Arsenal for $795, in 7.62x39, ill have it to the range soon and report back. Fit/finish/feel is way nice IMO than a typical saiga.

If you build an AR instead... you have the flexibility of swapping out barrels or uppers and having a new caliber at your disposal, just that quick.

Thanks for some of the quick info.

I guess you can probably tell I am....basically clueless in this market. So many choices....

As far as the AR and swapping out uppers, that is what originally drew me towards that. But I figured I could pick up a saiga and convert it for a considerable amount less than I could build an AR build, and that is why I decided to go this way....although, I am not 100% decided at this point.

All I do know is that I have that itch, that wont be scratched until I buy a new gun.

jaybird wrote:Thanks for some of the quick info.

I guess you can probably tell I am....basically clueless in this market. So many choices....

As far as the AR and swapping out uppers, that is what originally drew me towards that. But I figured I could pick up a saiga and convert it for a considerable amount less than I could build an AR build, and that is why I decided to go this way....although, I am not 100% decided at this point.

All I do know is that I have that itch, that wont be scratched until I buy a new gun.

You'll probably eventually end up with both. I have an ak in 7.62X39 and I love it. Like speed_racer said, if your going to get an ak, you might as well get the original caliber. It's fun to shoot and ammo is relatively inexpensive.

But now I want to build an AR

Enoch wrote:You'll probably eventually end up with both. I have an ak in 7.62X39 and I love it. Like speed_racer said, if your going to get an ak, you might as well get the original caliber. It's fun to shoot and ammo is relatively inexpensive.

But now I want to build an AR

That is a very good possibility. But not right now. I need to decide what I am going to buy, or knowing myself...I will go 'browsing' and end up buying something that I had no idea I wanted before I saw it. I am weak that way

I agree about the caliber on the AK. So at least I made one decision with all of yours help.

Get a Saiga and convert it.
JMO

Really tough to beat K-Var's AK platforms. You will see them for sale from time to time and they really hold their value well. There are a couple of companies out there that sell Century built AK's. For the price they are tough to beat.

Converting a Saiga is easy for the most part (as long as your somwhat mechanicaly inclined). The hardest part (but the most important part for me) is installing the bullet guide to let it accept standard/surplus AK mags. IF you don't install that you're stuck buying OEM Saiga (expensive) or Promags (not reliable).

If i were looking for a cheap (entry level) AK, i would probably get this converted Saiga below. All the work is done already, and they're only really marking up $50 more than what the rifle and coversion parts would cost themselves. ($300 rifle + $100 of conversion parts (buttstock, pistol grip, fire control group, bullet guide, and 30 round mag).

Scroll about halfway down for the converted one...

http://www.classicarms.us/semi-auto%20rifles.htm

Now that being said...I would not buy that rifle. I appreciate the fit finish of K-VAR/Arsenal AK's and will spend $600-$800 on those. I have 2 Arsenal AK's and i will never get rid of them. They also look a little more like a "real" AK with the correct handguards and threaded muzzle. If you do those 2 things to that Saiga you're probably looking at another $200-$250, so if those things are important to you, i'd get the K-VAR/Arsenal right off the bat becasue it will have a better fit and finish and hold its value much more than a converted Saiga.

The one thing i think Saiga's are GREAT for is the .308 caliber. They are the only one making an AK in that caliber (Mitchell Arms imported a few .308 AKs about 15 years ago, but those go for $1500+ and sometimes you can find a VEPR in .308 for $1000-$1200, but then the mags are impossible to find and you're stuck with the ugly factory buttstock). I got a .308 Saiga for $450-$500 and spend another $300 to convert it to look exactly like a "real" AK with the correct handguards, threaded the muzzle, and the rest of the normal conversion. I love that rifle and people always ask me what it is because at the range it looks like a normal everyday AK, but when i shoot it, you can tell it is something different. But even though it cycles Brown Bear .308 at $.33/round, my AKs that shoot Wolf .223 and 7.62x39 get much more use since they are only $.22/round to shoot

If it were me, I would build an ar15 first before I got an AK.

Just get a standard AK-47 (actually an AKM but that's nit-picking). Hollowpoint 7.62x39 is fine for the hogs and Florida deer at modest ranges, and they have 5 round hunting magazines. As far as I'm concerned there's little difference besides cosmetics between any of them, Saiga's, Romys, etc....
I've always had better reliability from AKs than SKS's, no jamming.
5.45 is too small for deer and hogs, ditto 5.56, and a .308/7.62x51 would be nice to have but expensive.

5.45 is about 13-14c/round, 7.62x39 is about 19c/round, 223 is about 25c - that's why I use the Russian calibers, cheaper in the long run.
I think 7.62 is a better choice for a semiautomatic weapon, girls love the 5.45 but some guys say you might as well be shooting .22.

Now in the 7.62 caliber, I personally love the Russian SKS rifles. I'd take a $400 carbine made to milspec under Stalin over a $400 Romanian AKM knockoff reassembled by drunk monkeys at Century Arms any day. Yeah they both work cause it's hard to make an AK jam, but milsurp SKS tend to be noticeably more accurate and have far better fit and finish. Russian SKSs aren't as tacticool as AKs, but are far better guns for the price.

As far as reliability issues mentioned here, I've never seen a Russian SKS jam; a friend of mine has a Chinese SKS and I've never seen that jam either. Now I've had a jam or two with a Yugo SKS way back, but that thing was pretty beat up to begin with. I've seen several Romanian AKs, my Polish Tantal, and the AK54R beast jam a few times each, so SKSs win that one too - which they should, because they aren't rebuilt, so better fit and factory testing.

Best wishes,
Daniel.