How to survive the Great Depression of 2008 - 2009

[NK]

The funny part is the guy says "you can buy the house back later......you can rent until then......"
Just where does he think the people that do this are going to get the money ? Nobody will lend it to them and I sure wouldn't rent a house to somebody who just walked away from their obligations.
Same ol' story.............my problems aren't my fault. Somebody owes me.

i think so many people will have bankruptcies that the banks will find new criteria to get people hooked back into the usury system.

either that or to stem the tide they will re-initiate deptors prison.

anyway, the writing is on the wall- something is down this trail we are headed on that is different from the normal incremental decline we are all used to. we are not immune to another depression.

[Wes Janson]

While normally I'd say that fulfilling one's obligations and debts is both noble and honorable, and should be done without fail, there must be room in ethical decisions to account for hostile behavior on the parts of others. If someone screws you over and you find out later, you don't have a moral obligation to stand around and let them do it to you again. Reap what you sow, and all that.

OTOH, this comes from someone who rents an apartment, and doesn't own a credit card.

[feedthehogs]

The guy is referring to those that were screwed by investment brokers

No one got screwed by anyone but themselves.

[Wulfmann]

This is a great country.
We give people freedom. Be smart and you have the freedom to make money or be stupid and loose your money. Nobody tells you what you can or can not do with your money (within limits). If you were stupid and lost all your money, well, maybe you are too dumb to have any money. If you loose all your money, house, car, etc. don't blame anyone else, you were just dumb.

OK, now if that is correct then if you were so screwed and you can give it back to those that screwed you then you can then make the same statement to the original lender that convinced someone that never could afford a home they should jump head first. Or, is it only OK for corporate America to screw the little guy but wrong if they get some back?

What some of you self righteous asses don't see is being in someone else's shoes.
I would never do any of the things suggested because I am not nor have never been in that position and know better to believe that crap.

However, take a family that never owned a home, that would like to see their kids have a place they can feel good about that will surely be worth more, as they are told and even though they can not afford it the nice man is showing them an interest only mortgage with nothing out of pocket that will be cheaper than their current rent and because it will escalate in value by 50k in one year they can then qualify for a fixed rate because they will be financing 80% of the then higher value.
Real estate only goes up can never go down if you don't do it now it will be too much next year and you will never own a house and your kids will always be poor and you will be stupid etc etc.
But, instead of it going up, the sure thing it was suppose to be, next year it dropped 25K then another year it dropped 50K more and your loan is now 75K more than the house is worth and the loan is resetting at $500.00 a month more and you simply can not pay it.
What some of you arrogant geniuses don't want to do is empathize with those not blessed with your superior intellect.
Imagine you are not as smart as you know you are and pretend for a minute what is like to not be as fortunate and then have someone show you a so called sure thing that will forever change the life of your family and give then a better life never imagined.
Then, when that comes crashing down you the one made to belief what turned out to be a lie, are left holding the bag while the brokers and lenders insist you alone should be held responsible for making a decision that you were talked into on the basis of what could never happen now in fact happening.
Try wearing that person's shoes and then tell me you would rather your kids live under an overpass asking for handouts rather than do to the lender the same thing they did to you.
That is, use the system to your advantage like they used the system to their advantage when they screwed you.

Ergo, have a heart, there are families being destroyed by being sold their dreams only to find they got a nightmare.
Yes many were greedy, the flippers buying 3, 4 homes and losing their butts, too bad.
Those flippers can not do what this guy suggest which is to say screw the system that screwed me, my family is more important than a CEO's retirement plan.
You have no problem with taxpayers spending billions to bail out the lenders well, here is a way for the little guy to get back at the big corporations and help his family.
I hope everyone that got sold this lie reads this guys how to and sticks it to the bankers good.
Be grateful, as I sure am, you knew better and never have to be in this situation

Wulfmann

[rez0nance]

Or, is it only OK for corporate America to screw the little guy but wrong if they get some back?

OH NOES!! CORPORATE AMERIKAZ!!!! HELPZ ME, TEH EVIL CORPORASHUNZ!!!=:wvr

Ergo, have a heart, there are families being destroyed by being sold their dreams only to find they got a nightmare.

Eh, no. I have no heart, and prefer it that way. Too much baggage to weigh you down, and makes you do (especially looking at this case and your suggestion, it seems) incredibly stupid crap.

If they didn't deign to do some research, at least a little damned research, on one of the biggest, if not the biggest purchase in their lives, and a life changing one at that, then screw them. If they were too stupid to balance their budget and buy what they could afford, screw them.

I really, truly couldn't care if they had to starve on the streets. And if you're talking about my damned hard earned tax money being sent to bail them out, that then becomes me hoping that they starve.

Keep the "compassion" crap to those who care. I prefer spending my money elsewhere.

Here come the "Oh, how dare you! You're sooo going to hell!" comments...

[limestonecowboy]

In response wulfmann:

In other words, just because you got screwed, you should screw them back.

I don't believe that is the moral thing to do in any situation.

[rug357]

... take a family that never owned a home, that would like to see their kids have a place they can feel good about that will surely be worth more, as they are told and even though they can not afford it the nice man is showing them an interest only mortgage with nothing out of pocket that will be cheaper than their current rent...

I got a e-mail from a nice man from Nigeria telling me that if I send him $2,000 I can make $2,000,000,000 from a pile of gold the previous king had hidden in the caves... Guess what, I didn send the nice man in Nigeria $2,000 nor did I send $1,000 to a nice man in Hong Kong, etc. I'm not dumb enough to believe everything I read or hear.

Nobody screwed these people, they screwed themselves. They just heard what they wanted to hear and were too lazy to do any research on their own. As our own RobS once wrote, some people are too stupid to own their own house, and in some cases I agree.

[False Prophet]

What some of you self righteous asses don't see is being in someone else's shoes.....

What some of you arrogant geniuses don't want to do is....

Eeeeaasy there fella. Everyone is entitled to their own opinion and I don't believe that anyone directed anything at you first. I may be an arrogant genius but I draw the line at 'self-righteous ass'.

[r127]

How very strange. This guy thinks there is no inflation or something.

Otherwise while I don't necessarily agree with his point of view I do recognize that it is the logical outcome of our banking, money and tax system. Our tax system punishes success but rewards failure, so fail. Our banking system creates money out of thin air without ever creating value so in the process buying power is destroyed. That means savings are destroyed. That means it does not make sense to save money because it will just evaporate away but it does make sense to take out longterm loans at low intrest because they become easier to pay over time. The author is suggesting indivudals do the exact same thing the fedgov and the FRB does, borrow money into existence with no concern about creating value or paying back debt.

So yeah, if you find this guy's ramblings morally offensive than you should be even more offended by the practice of the federal reserve bank, the federal government, the fractional reserve banking system as well as other related practics and entities. He is only suggesting that people do these things on an individual scale. The government and FRB are doing these same exact things on a national scale. Unless you just think it's the individual's role in society to be the ox chained to the plow which wittingly or not does seem to apply to a number of people.

Personally I say screw all that. What makes the most sense to me is don't bite off more than you can chew, don't save your money in dollars and do something that creates value.

[r127]

OH NOES!! CORPORATE AMERIKAZ!!!! HELPZ ME, TEH EVIL CORPORASHUNZ!!!=:wvr

In all fairness it isn't the fact that there are corporations or even the fact that those that do exist are trying to make a profit. Mercantilism is a real issue, so is the aforementioned dishonest system of banking and taxation. Otherwise I agree that stupid is as stupid does, so to speak.

[Wulfmann]

Nobody screwed these people, they screwed themselves. They just heard what they wanted to hear and were too lazy to do any research on their own. As our own RobS once wrote, some people are too stupid to own their own house, and in some cases I agree.

If that is the case then when do it back to the bank they are playing by the same set of rules this time in their favor. If it is OK for brokers to misrepresent these loans then it is just as OK for the borrowers to use the system legally to their advantage.

This bankers can screw people and if they ain'ts gots smarts nuf then too bad is not fair minded. If you guys don't think people should take advantage of the system when they have been screwed by it I suggest you lobby to change the laws.

There are certainly many cases of people that should have known better but there are also many cases of brokers being no more than money predators.

The little guys screwed over that uses the system back at them will continue to get my cheers. None of you has stated a word to change that opinion and again, I have paid every dime owed in my life and I got out of doing any homes after 2004 because I saw all this as insane.

In fact my own niece did not listen to me and paid $225K for a house 2 years ago I flat out told her would drop by 30% in two years. I was wrong the same house new is $149K so it was over 35% and still going down.
I have no sympathy for her, she was told and her mother is in banking.

I do not believe people should have their loans reduced and I do not believe their should be any bail out at all for real estate or the banks.

I just believe those that were badly screwed giving some back is fine by me.
Again, I am only referring to the home owner/single residence situation not multi-home buyers/flippers.

Try coming up with something better guys, you have said nothing but I didn't do it so these families should be forced to starve.

Wulfmann

[.45FMJoe]

This is a great country.
We give people freedom. Be smart and you have the freedom to make money or be stupid and loose your money. Nobody tells you what you can or can not do with your money (within limits). If you were stupid and lost all your money, well, maybe you are too dumb to have any money. If you loose all your money, house, car, etc. don't blame anyone else, you were just dumb.

I think that is a bit harsh. As Wulfmann pointed out, people went to "experts" who showed them what to do. When you are ignorant about how something works, you generally seek "expert" advice. In this case the experts were very misleading. I'm not in any financial trouble, and I have always paid my debts but I'm just saying I can see the other side. Yes honor counts for something, but you have to agree the loan agencies aren't exactly pillars of the community.

[Glades]

BUMP! was this written in April?

Any changes of opinions? Looks like the feds are bailing out the banks. What do you think of this post? That is now?

[Mr. Smith]

Okay, I'll bite...

Gold and silver. These things are not stocks. They do not get high and split. They go up when inflation is here. They go up, way up. Commercials will tell you to buy gold. Then it is over and they drop down to the normal 100 or 200 for gold and 3 to 7 dollars for silver. It is your money, piss it away if you wish, but my advice is to stay away from gold or silver.

I’m not with you on the gold and silver. Gold at the “normal” $100 or 200! Wouldn’t that be nice? The fact of the matter is that the price of gold has been slowly but surely rising over the last decade.

http://www.kitco.com/charts/popup/au3650nyb_.html

When you talk about the price of gold you’re talking about the price of gold relative to American dollars. Price is about supply and demand. Barring some eureka-type of new discovery that dramatically increases the supply of gold we will continue to see the average price of gold go up. Why? Because our government prints money at will, and will continue to increase the supply of cash. This is even more true now that our government feels it can leverage its way out of the current economic crisis by printing more money! How else can a bankrupt government pay for all the current bailouts? Must be nice to have the ability to print money at will!

If you want to be financially protected be as diversified as possible. I DO NOT believe that buying gold or silver is stupid. It would be stupid to put ALL of your money in gold, but it would be VERY prudent to have some of your savings in precious metal bullion – especially now. Apparently I’m not alone. I recently called around to buy a few American Eagles and there are very few places that even have them. I’m told that they can’t keep up with demand. Most places that do have them are limiting quantities of the sales to serve more customers. A basic variation of this same news theme is what I heard from three widely geographically separated bullion supply houses this past week.

IMHO, of course.

Smith

[Glades]

Mr. Smith: It would be stupid to put ALL of your money in gold, but it would be VERY prudent to have some of your savings in precious metal bullion – especially now.

So what do you think about that survivor's silver and gold? Do you think it would be helpful to have around in a big recession? Those collectors coins are too high priced and the comission on them is high also.

http://www.marketwatch.com/news/story/gullible-consumers-may-get-gored/story.aspx?guid=%257BAF683292-775D-4EA9-B387-CAFCEFD786E1%257D&dist=hppr&gclid=CNq9xpD8mJYCFQ8QagodLAcp6g

[Mr. Smith]

I’m not exactly sure what you mean by “survivor's silver and gold” but I think you’re right about NOT buying coins that have what they call numismatic value, which is the value above the cost of the gold or silver in the coin. As you know some rare coins have a high value but the value is based on how rare the coin is, not the value of metal that the coin is struck from.

My advice, if you’re buying gold or silver for “when the stuff hits the fan” is to buy gold or silver coins that have NO numismatic value, but are widely recognized as reliable bullion coins; some examples would be: South African Krugerrands, Canadian Maple leafs, or American Gold Eagles.

The link you had was an article about how nefarious these TV gold buyers are. You know those companies that advertise telling you to send them your old gold jewellery etc. and then they’ll send you a check. I can’t imagine anyone sending a company their gold without knowing how much they were going to pay for it. That would be like a car dealer asking for you to bring in your car and then after you’ve already agreed to sell it to them – they’ll tell you how much they’ll give you for it! I guess PT Barnum was right there is a sucker born every minute.

Smith

[Crashpanic]

This article encapsulates the kind of attitude that got us into this mess: no personal responsibility. I am still lucky enough to have a job and afford my mortgage, but if I am unable to pay my debt in the future, it will be because it is not within my power, not because I want to screw the system.

Crash

[RyanHK21EOwner]

This article encapsulates the kind of attitude that got us into this mess: no personal responsibility. I am still lucky enough to have a job and afford my mortgage, but if I am unable to pay my debt in the future, it will be because it is not within my power, not because I want to screw the system.

Crash

**** You just hit the ball outta the park with that statement Crashpanic ****

I've accumulated about $ 95,000.00 in debt from both businesses with-in the past 16 months because of the economic BS...

I'm angry I was forced into this debt hole beyond my control with a 50% customer loss...

My $ 100,000.00 emergency line of credit which is practically maxed out was used to scale my business down...

I have no more working capitol... ZERO -0- Nothing nadda, because of other people...

I'm at the point where if I make it I make it... If I don't I don't... I'm maxed out from scaling back...

The whole system took away everything I worked hard to build up the last 8 years... Just like anyones 401k savings... ALL if not partially gone...

I never did anything with housing... I knew it was fake while it was being flaunted in my face between 2002-2005... I paid my debts and all obligations...

I'm pissed off this crisis has affected my business like it has... Now I'm near my own crisis because of other people's actions...

[Jim311]

I like how he insinuates that you can just default on your home and buy another for way less in the future. As if any bank will loan you the money a few years from now due to your chitty credit!! If you DO buy the home you'll be paying through the nose in interest. This guy sounds like he fell for some adjustable rate mortgage and had to go through this process himself. The people who locked themselves into loans they can't afford have nobody to blame but themselves. Nobody FORCED them to accept a mortgage they couldn't afford, and it's their own fault if they did!

[Glades]

I think, but Im not to sure that survivors silver is a common coin that is used in a hard time to pay for services. I hit the site and read it one night, but I can't find the same site in my history, now. I would buy survivors silver the same way I would by mags for my guns. It is for practical use.