Florida Shooters Network

I figured it was about time to bump this thread.

So...Watching the early polls come in tonight.....Santorum? Really??

Wow. If he wins Minnesota and the non binding Missouri primary....that throws this whole race into the wind.

And if he can make a good showing in Colorado..... ho lee sheet.

Thoughts?

Honestly (and I don't mean this in a condescending way), I believe it is just prolonging the inevitable now, a Romney nomination. I really like Santorum and wouldn't mind seeing him in there (despite his hardcore neo-conservatism). Either way, I'm just tired of Newt coming back; he reminds me of a bad movie that directors keep making remakes of for god knows whatever reason.

*ahem* Saw, Scream, and that other gay teenage movie franchise that I can't remember where ppl are always dying.

Someone help me here...

Colorado is a pretty libertarian state. Paul has been doing good in libertarian states: 2nd place in the NH primary and 3rd from the Nevada Caucus. iirc, his pledged delegates juped from 10 to 15. and as the news has been saying, as well as RP himself, while other people are doing way better than him, it could be more mementary, whereas Paul's success is because of dedicated followers, that are mobilizing for the long haul.

imo, there is STILL a chance for Paul.

Not a trainwreck, anymore than 2008 and Operation Chaos was for the Dems. Obama actually accused Hillary of the horrible sin of trying to force Americans to buy health insurance by a mandate!

As a former Pennsylvaian I followed Santorums wrecking his Senate career and final campign with a lot of teeth grinding. I'm not gonna psychoanalyze him but he did a heck of a good job making sure he'd lose, and I don't see any signs of him changing this year. The only reason he won the beauty contests yesterday is that the voters had no other even faintly viable Conservative to fall back on. Given a bigger, more inclusive electorate, he's toast.

I have no use for Santorum, but what the GOP shills here can't admit is that the harder they and the GOP Establishment try to cram Romney down the throats of GOP voters, the more those voters resist--that is the sum total of Santorum's success. Romney romped 4 years ago in Minnesota--yesterday he got killed. In the primaries Romney can win liberal states and Mountain West states that have significant Mormon populations--that is all he's shown so far. But those liberal states won't mean dickfist in the general election, since they will go for Obama anyway.

Trainwreck is absolutely damned right.

PS: the libs are laughing all the way about things, which should worry you because many of the things they are laughing about are true:

http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2012/02/07/paul-begala-santorum-spanks-romney-in-midwestern-primaries.html

Paul Begala: Santorum Spanks Romney in Midwestern Primaries

It was a stunning repudiation of the ostensible frontrunner. Mitt’s super PAC outspent Santorum’s 40 to 1—only to come in third place in Minnesota?
by Paul Begala | February 7, 2012 11:15 PM EST

Mitt Romney didn't just lose. He lost to Muhammad, Jugdish, Sidney, and Clayton—the archetypal losers from Animal House.

The story of Missouri, Minnesota, and Colorado is the stunning weakness of Mitt Romney.

Rick Santorum's impressive victory in the nonbinding Missouri "beauty contest" began an ugly night for Romney. Mitt, who garnered 29 percent in Missouri in 2008, limped in with 25 percent—fewer than half the votes Santorum earned (55 percent).

Then came Minnesota, where Romney lost again. Big time. He won the state four years ago—earning 41 percent, But Tuesday night, he won only 17 percent, for a stunning third-place finish behind Santorum and Ron Paul.

Finally—and perhaps most embarrassingly of all—is Colorado. Romney romped there in 2008 with 60 percent. This year, he limped in with 35 percent and lost to Santorum's 40 percent.

Romney has more money, more national experience, more consultants, more staff. Heck, he even has better hair. His super PAC outspent Santorum's by a 40-to-1 margin. Forty to one. And yet Mitt Romney lost. He lost to a guy who lost his home state by 18 points the last time he was on the ballot there. There's a technical term in political consulting for a performance like that: it's called sucking. If Romney can't beat Rick Santorum, he needs to find another party to run in.

The lesson from Missouri, as Santorum's talented admaker, John Brabender, told The New York Times's John Harwood: "in a clean one-on-one with Romney, we beat him."

Team Romney might say, "Au contraire." They would surely note that Missouri didn't count. Technically accurate, politically untrue. Romney losing a nonbinding primary to Santorum is like the New York Yankees losing an exhibition game to a church-league softball team.

Minnesota is even harder for Romney to explain. He not only had all the money, he had the support of the former governor (and former GOP presidential candidate) Tim Pawlenty. Which was worth a warm bucket of spit.


Romney better pray Newt's massive ego doesn't collapse in on itself like a black hole or he's in big trouble:

http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2012/02/08/newt-s-two-man-race-narrative-collapses-after-santorum-victories.html

Newt’s Two-Man-Race Narrative Collapses After Santorum Victories
With Rick Santorum’s wins in Missouri, Colorado, and Minnesota, Newt Gingrich loses his claim to being the leading conservative alternative to Mitt Romney.
by John Avlon | February 8, 2012 12:43 AM EST

This is the story of Newt and the Terrible, Horrible, No Good, Very Bad Day.

It is a tale of two caucus states where Newt was schooled by Rick Santorum in the ways of social-conservative voters and one state where he failed to even make the primary ballot.

Worst of all, it was the day when Newt’s narrative of a two-man race collapsed.

Because right now, angry and almost broke, Newt is no longer the leading candidate to be the conservative alternative to Mitt Romney. That man is Rick Santorum. And what makes Gingrich especially grumpy is that the man he is losing to was once just a pimply backbencher in the 1994 Republican Revolution.

After winning South Carolina, Newt spent all his money trying to win Florida and took $15 million dollars of incoming fire from Mitt Romney. Rick Santorum saved his money and went to Minnesota.

Missouri’s primary race was an expensive beauty pageant with no delegates at stake. But Newt’s organizational failure allowed Rick Santorum a chance to test the fantasy both men have been indulging—a mano-a-mano contest with Mitt. And without a second social conservative in the race, Rick Santorum beat Mitt handily in this particular popularity contest. It is, after all, John Ashcroft’s home state.

Even in Colorado Newt couldn’t catch a break. After running neck and neck all night with Romney, Santorum finally won that contest.

So for now Newt is left broke and unloved, facing the long road ahead with a raised fist. There probably will be better days ahead—Super Tuesday offers Southern states, and Newt has already proven his ability to rise from the political dead. But Rick Santorum just had his best night of the campaign. For all his faults, he has none of the personal baggage of Newt that might offend the faithful.

Newt can find a silver lining somewhere—at least now Rick Santorum will be the target of Mitt Romney’s million-dollar negative attacks.

That’s a thought that can keep Newt warm inside as he faces the future, just him and Callista in a guerilla campaign against the establishment, trying to finally prove that we live in a Newt-centric universe, after all.

Tom Fernandez wrote:Honestly (and I don't mean this in a condescending way), I believe it is just prolonging the inevitable now, a Romney nomination. I really like Santorum and wouldn't mind seeing him in there (despite his hardcore neo-conservatism). Either way, I'm just tired of Newt coming back; he reminds me of a bad movie that directors keep making remakes of for god knows whatever reason.

*ahem* Saw, Scream, and that other gay teenage movie franchise that I can't remember where ppl are always dying.

Someone help me here...

It still is another huge 'reset' button to the race. And it just makes this much more likely to go all the way to the convention. With these wins for Santorum, he isnt going anywhere for a long time.

Newt isnt going anywhere until he has his say in the south.

And Paul isnt going anywhere either.

That is 4. FOUR.....going at least past super tuesday, and possibly much longer.

Where did all of Santorum's support come from? He got more votes in Colorado, then were cast for ALL candidates in that caucus in 2008. A caucus that Romney won.

Minnesota was another state that Romney had won in 2008, and lost now. 3 times more people voted for Romney in 2008 than voted for Romney in 2012 in that Primary. ie, his support in that state DROPPED by like 300% in average turnout. Those were real votes. Approximately 25,000 people voted for him in 2008, but only about 8000 for him this year?????

Now....I am not saying that Mitt is or isnt going to be the eventual nominee. He has the cash and the organization. But if people dont vote for you....if people that voted for you in 2008 dont want to vote for you anymore......your campaign has problems. Serious Problems.

Now...I am sure we will see the full attack on Santorum. And the sad thing is....I think that will just turn people off of Romney even more.

He may win the nomination by delegate numbers eventually.....but his campaign has serious problems....that will be more apparent come general election.

tector wrote:I have no use for Santorum, but what the GOP shills here can't admit is that the harder they and the GOP Establishment try to cram Romney down the throats of GOP voters, the more those voters resist--that is the sum total of Santorum's success. Romney romped 4 years ago in Minnesota--yesterday he got killed. In the primaries Romney can win liberal states and Mountain West states that have significant Mormon populations--that is all he's shown so far. But those liberal states won't mean dickfist in the general election, since they will go for Obama anyway.

Trainwreck is absolutely damned right.

THAT is very true.