Concealed-Carry Myths

State and national practical & political discussions on legal open, concealed and vehicle carry.

Concealed-Carry Myths

Postby Onree » Wed Jan 04, 2012 10:30 am

http://www.shootingillustrated.com/inde ... rry-myths/

Many new concealed-carry permit holders subscribe to a variety of myths that could have potentially deadly consequences. Here are five of the most common.

By Paul Markel (RSS)
December 15, 2011

It’s been said all the best stories begin with either “Once upon a time” or “There I was.” There are other tales that begin with “I was talking to my buddy and he said…” Over the years, I’ve developed a reflexive cringe from all the times I’ve heard someone begin a conversation with such verbiage.

If we are talking about venison recipes or the best way to get red wine stains out of your dress shirt, opinions vary and it’s not that big a deal if the advice doesn’t quite pan out. However, when we are talking about the most important activity you can undertake—protecting your life and the lives of your family members—bad advice can have dire consequences.

In the United States today, there is little doubt concealed carry is one of the hottest topics, at least for gun owners. Sales figures for compact, concealable handguns bear out this argument. Furthermore, at last count, there was a grand total of one state that had absolutely no provision to allow their citizens to carry a concealed handgun. In the other states, the majority have shall-issue laws on the books.

Obtaining a lawful permit or permission to carry a concealed handgun is only one part of the equation. I’ve encountered dozens of citizens who obtained a permit but don’t carry because they do not feel comfortable or capable of actually using a gun for personal protection. The reasons vary, but they generally boil down to a lack of training and/or misunderstanding what it means to be an armed citizen.

Carry Only When Needed

I am certain my face shows distress when I hear someone say they have a CCW permit but they “…only carry it when I think I might need it.” My patent answer to that statement is, “If you think you are going to need a gun, don’t go there.” Or more aptly, “If you know you need a gun you should take a rifle or a shotgun, not a concealed handgun.”

The Smith & Wesson J-frame is easy to carry and extremely reliable, but requires dedicated effort to master.

If I knew I was going to a fight I’d prefer to take the USS Missouri, but battleships are tough to conceal.

Carrying only once in a while, when you think you might need it, is akin to purchasing car insurance that only covers you on Friday nights from 6 p.m. to 2 a.m. and every other Saturday. Certainly, you wouldn’t buy an insurance policy that only covered you on random dates or occasions.

When you obtain a carry permit, you are essentially purchasing life assurance—life insurance only kicks in once you are at room temperature. When you’ve decided to arm yourself against unknown, unanticipated threats, you need to do it as often as humanly possible.

Empty Chambers are Happy Chambers

In an effort to seem reasonable or extra safe, some permit holders will carry their semi-automatic pistols with a loaded magazine in place and the chamber empty. Not on the nightstand mind you, but in their holsters. I’ve also encountered double-action revolver owners who will deliberately prestage an empty chamber so the first hammer strike falls on nothing.

Good training is key before you carry. Regular practice afterward not only sharpens your skills, but provides the kind of confidence it will take Good training is key before you carry. Regular practice afterward not only sharpens your skills, but provides the kind of confidence it will take to defend your life.

The reason for this thinking is typically little or no training and a bit of insecurity. In an effort to be “extra safe” by keeping the chamber empty, the gun owner is assuming they will always have the time and ability to draw their pistol and charge a round before they need to fire.

In both the semi-automatic and revolver scenarios, the shooter is purposely reducing his round count and increasing the amount of time it will take to get the gun in the fight. Should you be attacked with deadly force, time is likely not something you will have on your side and you may need every round you have.

One of the most dangerous aspects of this practice is you wind up playing the “Is my gun loaded or not?” game. It also leads to “It’s alright, the chamber is empty,” type of thinking. Loaded guns are safe guns because people treat them with respect. I once had a pistol fired into the ground 2 feet from me because the shooter thought the chamber was empty, so it would be safe to dry-fire.

Women Should Only Shoot .22s

While .22 LR handguns are fantastic training tools and excellent ways to learn the basics of marksmanship, they are not the best fight stoppers in the world. It is true, as my friend Walt Rauch once advised, “No one wants to leak, not even bad guys.” However, there is no reason a healthy adult woman cannot carry and employ a centerfire handgun.

Ruger’s LCP in .380 ACP and LCR in .38 Spl. are both wildly popular for concealed carry, but it is vital to train with these compact handguns despite the inherent difficulty in shooting a small pistol.

Not long ago, a woman told me when the subject of a defensive handgun came up, one of her male co-workers told her to buy a .22 and load it with dum-dum rounds. Yes, that was the exact term he used. Dum-dum rounds aside, the purpose of defensive shooting is to force the attacker to stop, not to bleed to death 20 minutes later.

A centerfire pistol or revolver with a bore diameter of .35 inch and up is a good place to start. Concealable handguns from .380 ACP up to .45 ACP abound and are readily available. The recoil impulse from the .45 ACP is generally less severe than that of a .40 S&W from the same-size handgun. I’ve encountered numerous women who could run a 1911 like no one’s business. The question was not the sex of the shooter or their size, but rather their level of training and their experience.

Practice Gun Zen

Another common trend I’ve come across is the carry gun versus the range gun. Folks will go out and purchase the latest, greatest compact or subcompact pistol. They’ll boast to their buddies about how easy it is to carry and conceal. They can carry it all day and forget it’s in their pocket. That covers step one—be armed.

When it comes time to hit the range, these very same guys pull out a pistol with a 5- or 6-inch barrel, target sights and meticulously tuned trigger. From 10 yards, they set about punching neat little holes in paper targets and call it training.

Don’t get me wrong, shooting should be enjoyable recreation. It can be a great way to spend an afternoon. However, if you bought a compact .380 ACP pistol for personal protection and still haven’t gotten through your first box of 50 rounds, you are kidding yourself if you think you’re ready for combat.

By their very design, compact, lightweight pistols and revolvers are easy to carry and difficult to shoot well. These guns demand you train and practice with them. You might be able to plink a soda can a 20 yards with a Ruger Mark III pistol, but that’s not likely to be the gun you’ll have on you when a bad guy shows up. Can you hit a soda can at 10 feet with your pocket pistol?

A compact Glock, such as a G19 or G23, can be carried concealed all day long with proper holster. Carrying a spare magazine is always a good idea.

This is an easy trap to fall into. Your shot groups don’t look as good with the pocket gun as they do with your larger target pistol. Park your ego at the door and practice with the pocket pistol. One day, you might be glad you did.

Hand Me Down That Gun

Many who decide to carry a gun are not gun people. They don’t subscribe to any gun magazines and don’t know or care about the history or nomenclature of firearms. All they know is they need a gun for personal protection. I’ve run into this many times during concealed-carry training courses and I’ve spoken to several trainers across the nation who agree this seems to be a trend.

Students, many of whom are women, will arrive at the class with gun handed down to them by great uncle Joe or grandpa Jim. Some have never put a single shot through the gun, but they load them up with the ammo uncle Joe gave them and keep them on the nightstand, the car or in their purses.

Far too many of these family heirlooms are in such poor condition, they can’t be relied upon to fire two rounds in succession. During one course, I had a lady show up with a double-action revolver given to her by her grandfather. The timing was so out of whack, it took her three to four trigger pulls to get a cartridge to fire.

At another course, a shooter arrived with a compact .22 LR semi-automatic pistol passed down by a relative. This person had it for two years and had never fired a round through the gun. When it came time for the live-fire portion, we discovered it was essentially a single-shot pistol. The gun this citizen had been keeping loaded, “just in case,” malfunctioned after the first shot and would not cycle or feed from the magazine.

The Winning Formula

The good news is when these folks show up for a training class, it becomes immediately, if not painfully, obvious they have been getting by on luck for a long time. Unfortunately, too many people feel owning a gun takes care of the personal-protection issue. To paraphrase Col. Jeff Cooper, owning a gun doesn’t make you any more an armed citizen than owning a guitar makes you a musician.

It really is not possible to train yourself. You can practice on your own, but unless you’ve had professional instruction you are likely just ingraining bad habits. A good training course will teach you what to practice and the best ways to do so.

Shooters will often leave a course amazed at how much they didn’t know when they arrived, and that is a positive thing. They are now on their way—they’ve become a student of the gun.

If you are truly serious about defending yourself with a firearm and carrying one on a regular basis, there are several steps you should take. Apply for your CCW permit, purchase a quality firearm, get some training and then practice often.

It’s really not all that complex of a formula, but I’m dismayed by how many folks stop after the first step. When all is said and done, it’s your life on the line—the choice is up to you.
There is an undeniable cultural difference. It's the difference in the mindset of those who believe they are owed a living, and those who believe success is the result of hard work.

http://obamaclock.org

Safety Bullet
User avatar
Onree
Life Member
Life Member
 
Posts: 6043
Joined: Wed Jan 16, 2008 9:53 am
Location: Lakeland

Re: Concealed-Carry Myths

Postby yeros68 » Wed Jan 04, 2012 3:25 pm

Lotsa good points Onree. I can comment on the aspect of keeping the chamber empty. I guess the bozos think its for safety. We know better. Part of the myth comes from the numerous TV shows & movies that show BGs & LEOs pulling out a gun and chambering a round with the slide (Oh how I hate that.) It is strictly for effect in the show to let the viewer know that somethings probably getting ready to go down. Absolutely absurd in real life.
yeros68
Member
Member
 
Posts: 78
Joined: Fri Dec 02, 2011 9:09 am
Location: Palm Beach county

Re: Concealed-Carry Myths

Postby g.willikers » Wed Jan 04, 2012 4:53 pm

Somewhere on the web, probably on youtube, there's a very convincing video of an effective way to deploy a semiauto that is carried with an empty chamber.
The guy on the video demonstrates a draw, round chambered and side step that is slick.
He promotes the added bit of safety in having an empty chamber, if someone would grab his gun.
It's very convincing for carrying with an empty chamber as another alternative.
I'll see if I can find the video, as it's definitely worth a look see.
g.willikers
Life Member
Life Member
 
Posts: 2633
Joined: Sat Dec 01, 2007 1:30 pm
Location: Sarasota

Re: Concealed-Carry Myths

Postby g.willikers » Wed Jan 04, 2012 5:16 pm

Here's a few videos about carrying with an empty chamber.
Not the one I was looking for, but good ones, still.
The one real problem is that it either takes two hands, or using something else to chamber that first round.
But it still can be a viable alternative.
Anyhow, it's worth a look.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rGD2j9ks ... playnext=2
g.willikers
Life Member
Life Member
 
Posts: 2633
Joined: Sat Dec 01, 2007 1:30 pm
Location: Sarasota

Re: Concealed-Carry Myths

Postby FL_Cowboy » Thu Jan 05, 2012 2:04 pm

Carrying on a empty chamber is a hold over from the days of the cowboys. The Colt 1851, 1861, and Remington 1858 were all Cap and Ball Revolvers. Back in the day you'd load one, skip one, and load four. Thus when you uncock the firearm the hammer would be resting on a empty chamber (no powder, ball, and firing cap). The proper way to carry those guns was to rest the hammer between the nipples on the cylinder. But many didn't do so because they didn't know better or their firearms were in a state of disrepair. This is further done on the old Colt 1873 Single Action Revolvers due to the "safety sear". It was common that if the weapon received a heavy hit on the hammer that it would go off. That is why in 1973 Ruger started to make all of their Single Action Guns with Transfer Bar Safeties. The Pre 1973 guns were all clones of the original Colt Guns.

Further this mindset went on in the US Army due to the Cavalry and the adaption of the 1911.

Condition 0 – A round is in the chamber, hammer is cocked, and the safety is off.
Condition 1 – Also known as “cocked and locked,” means a round is in the chamber, the hammer is cocked, and the manual thumb safety on the side of the frame is applied.
Condition 2 – A round is in the chamber and the hammer is down.
Condition 3 – The chamber is empty and hammer is down with a charged magazine in the gun.
Condition 4 – The chamber is empty, hammer is down and no magazine is in the gun.

The father of a very close friend of mine kept a S&W 686 loaded with five rounds only. When I asked him why he stated that "it's because if the hammer get's hit the gun can go off. That's what I was thought in the Army and that's what all the cowboys did."

I had to explain to him the function of a modern L-Frame S&W in that it had a transfer bar safety and that it was 110% safe to load and carry with six rounds. He trained on a S&W Victory Model back in the 1960s and there was a famous incident in which a Victory Model did kill a US Sailor during WWII because it was dropped. This was before S&W put the transfer bar safety in their guns. H&R did ads back in the turn of the 20th Century showing that you could hit their hammer with a hammer and it would not go off due to the transfer bar safety.

Another good friend of mine was almost mugged at a gas station in Texas when we was moving from Miami to Marine Corps Air Ground Combat Center's 29 Palms. He carried a GLOCK with a empty chamber. To skip the story he drew his firearm and the two scumbags fled the area without any further action. He stated that he didn't have time to chamber a round and if he had to shoot he'd be dead. He now carries the GLOCK with a loaded chamber.

Another common myth that I hate is the shotgun myths regarding home defense. Such as the "Rack the Slide" and the bad guy will leave, you don't need to aim a shotgun, or use bird shot for home defense because it doesn't go through walls. With that I have two answers. Racking the slide to scare the bad guy away means you do not have the mental maturity to defend yourself with force and the possibility that you might have to take a life to do so. You are placing your entire strategy of defense on the hope that the sound will scare the bad guy away. Guess what.... most bad guys don't give a crap. You can miss with a shotgun and you do need to aim. At 25 yards; a pattern of 00 Buck shot is only about the size of a large pizza pie. That's pretty damn small. AIM AT YOUR TARGET! As for using bird shot.... bird shot is for tiny little birds that are the size of a base ball. If you don't use bird shot on a deer or hog what makes you think it would work on a human being? Deer and Hogs are very good representative targets to study the effects of what it might do on a human being. Most weigh about the same as an adult human, the organs and body cavity are about the same too. If it can take down a white tail deer or a hog it can take down a human. 00 Buck and Slug are perfect for humans just as they are perfect for deer and hogs.
User avatar
FL_Cowboy
Senior Member
Senior Member
 
Posts: 293
Joined: Fri Nov 06, 2009 1:48 pm
Location: Miami, Florida

Re: Concealed-Carry Myths

Postby lucy » Thu Jan 05, 2012 2:18 pm

Just a thought...

What are the consequences of firing a semi-auto carried with an empty chamber in self-defense?

Well, if you have to rack the slide to load the weapon...then you obviously had to "pre-meditate" your actions and may be subject to assault-type charges by an overzealous prosecutor.

What are the chances of that? H-e-double toothpicks if I know. Like I said, just a thought.
lucy
Senior Member
Senior Member
 
Posts: 440
Joined: Fri Nov 16, 2007 9:24 am
Location: Winter Springs (Orlando)

Re: Concealed-Carry Myths

Postby Synaptic Misfire » Thu Jan 05, 2012 5:18 pm

Carrying a semi-auto on an empty chamber require several flawed assumption.

1. You will see your attacker
2. Your attacker will be far enough away for you to chamber a round
3. You will have two hands free to chamber a round

Empty chamber = empty gun = paper weight.

If you are uncomfortable carrying condition 1, then don't carry or nut up and accept the responsibility of carrying.
"Maybe when we secede, we'll just take the Constitution with us.
Nobody in DC is using it anyway." -Joe C. Wales

Ronald Reagan brought down the 2nd most powerful nation in the world-the Soviet Union.
Barack Obama is trying to bring down the most powerful nation in the world-the United States of America
Synaptic Misfire
Life Member
Life Member
 
Posts: 1295
Joined: Sat Oct 20, 2007 1:37 pm
Location: St. Pete Florida

Re: Concealed-Carry Myths

Postby rug357 » Thu Jan 05, 2012 5:59 pm

One thats not on the list are people who carry the pistol with factory self-defense ammo but only shoots FMJ at the range.
They assume the factory self-defense ammo will feed in their pistol... but you know what they say about assume...
Yes, factory self-defense ammo is not cheap but I would think people would place higher value on their life than couple box of "expensive" ammo.
Fools learn from experience, intellegent person learns from experience of others.
She may not be of my flesh and blood but she is of my heart and soul.
User avatar
rug357
Moderator
Moderator
 
Posts: 3033
Joined: Tue Sep 23, 2003 2:23 am
Location: Pembroke Pines (just North of Miami)

Re: Concealed-Carry Myths

Postby Synaptic Misfire » Thu Jan 05, 2012 6:31 pm

rug357 wrote:One thats not on the list are people who carry the pistol with factory self-defense ammo but only shoots FMJ at the range.
They assume the factory self-defense ammo will feed in their pistol... but you know what they say about assume...
Yes, factory self-defense ammo is not cheap but I would think people would place higher value on their life than couple box of "expensive" ammo.


Excellent point. My carry pistol shifts POI by three inches at fifteen feet between FMJ and my carry ammo.
"Maybe when we secede, we'll just take the Constitution with us.
Nobody in DC is using it anyway." -Joe C. Wales

Ronald Reagan brought down the 2nd most powerful nation in the world-the Soviet Union.
Barack Obama is trying to bring down the most powerful nation in the world-the United States of America
Synaptic Misfire
Life Member
Life Member
 
Posts: 1295
Joined: Sat Oct 20, 2007 1:37 pm
Location: St. Pete Florida

Re: Concealed-Carry Myths

Postby n0rlf » Thu Jan 05, 2012 8:21 pm

I shoot all me current SD carry ammo every six months and replace it with new stuff. Can I point out a study to show why, no! But I feel more comfortable doing it that way. I always know where the carry gun is going to hit with my carry ammo that way.

Ymmv

Mike
Remember:
2 truths in life
It is easier to seek forgiveness than permission!
Always drink upstream from the herd!
User avatar
n0rlf
Life Member
Life Member
 
Posts: 1351
Joined: Mon Apr 24, 2006 7:43 pm
Location: Lakeland

Re: Concealed-Carry Myths

Postby FL_Cowboy » Fri Jan 06, 2012 4:57 am

rug357 wrote:One thats not on the list are people who carry the pistol with factory self-defense ammo but only shoots FMJ at the range.
They assume the factory self-defense ammo will feed in their pistol... but you know what they say about assume...
Yes, factory self-defense ammo is not cheap but I would think people would place higher value on their life than couple box of "expensive" ammo.


if it's a firearm I am going to carry for self defense whether it is for on duty work of off duty use I run at least 100 rounds of the SD ammo through it... which happens to be one caliber or another of the Winchester Ranger SXT load. Thats the ammo I carry at work and I know of it's track record in 9x19mm, .40 S&W, and .45 ACP so of course I would carry that brand of ammo off duty.

Folks that don't run their guns with the good stuff and simply shoot cheap FMJ are running the risk of getting screwed over. You could have a failure to feed or a difference in point of impact.

I train with the cheap stuff for practice in reloading drills, draw drills, etc... but I also always will test my guns with the good stuff to make sure that they work.
User avatar
FL_Cowboy
Senior Member
Senior Member
 
Posts: 293
Joined: Fri Nov 06, 2009 1:48 pm
Location: Miami, Florida

Re: Concealed-Carry Myths

Postby m2arms » Fri Jan 06, 2012 11:25 am

you guys have your self defense concepts all wrong...learn from the best...

Image
User avatar
m2arms
Junior Member
Junior Member
 
Posts: 13
Joined: Sat Dec 24, 2011 2:32 pm

Re: Concealed-Carry Myths

Postby Limeybtrd » Sat Jan 07, 2012 9:14 pm

n0rlf wrote:I shoot all me current SD carry ammo every six months and replace it with new stuff. Can I point out a study to show why, no! But I feel more comfortable doing it that way. I always know where the carry gun is going to hit with my carry ammo that way.

Ymmv

Mike


I don't bother with self defense ammo anymore. Regular range sh** is good enough.
British Expat Living in the Land of the Free.

Formally known as Frederick but now Limeybstrd.
Limeybtrd
Senior Member
Senior Member
 
Posts: 271
Joined: Fri Jan 23, 2009 8:36 pm
Location: Spring Hill and Tampa.


Return to The Carry Forum

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 0 guests